Since the last time we had a topic about what to do with the clubs/associations, I've been thinking a lot about what we could do to make them more fun to participate in, and also how to differentiate them from each other and I came up with this, so I wanted to see what people thought.

(I hope this makes sense, it's late, haha)

Okay, so what if we took the clubs and used what we already had, but made it so that each club had the elected president, who then stayed the president until either they resigned or were impeached for inactivity or breaking rules (at which point it would go up for re-election). And then we could make the clubs much more community oriented things (like the designer circle type of things), and convert any associations that are community oritented into clubs (and the current owners of the associations would be able to stay as a permanent president, until they decided to step down or whatever, like all of the clubs). And then maybe clubs could hand out their own club achievement or something?

And then we could make associations much more horse/dog oriented, like the real-life breeders associations, and had a registry that was worth more, and maybe they could even have their own special type of show. Like a show that ran once a month, that awarded a bunch of points and possibly money, but that wasn't randomly judged. Like it could judge on a point system based on the animal's points, born-with points, energy, # of offspring, number of regular shows entered, number of club and association registries, etc. This could add a new layer of complexity to trainging and showing animals without over-complicating things for those who didn't want to participate. And it would also give everyone something else to compete for and give associations a purpose. And maybe assocations could have a "board" of people running them. Like a president, vice president, etc.

What do you think? It's just something I've been turning over in my mind, so I thought I would make a topic and see what people think.

Just bumping this up to the top!

I think that sounds great! 
I do have a couple of questions though.
1. What would be required in order to 'impeach' a president?
2. Would it be possible for associations/clubs to have their own accomplishments that they can award for certain things?

1. It would basically be the same way we do associations. Like if the president hasn't done anything with the club or logged in for awhile.

2. Yes!

I'm confused by this: "who then stayed the president until either they resigned or were impeached for inactivity or breaking rules (at which point it would go up for re-election). "

So if someone was impeached, would we have like a month where it just sat, empty, while an election is run? That doesn't sound good. Or would people be able to put their name in at any time, just in case the president gets impeached? If that's the case, then what if someone gets like 1000 votes, goes inactive, and automatically becomes preident, and we have to wait for them to get impeached before someone else can take it over? 

I just can't think of a good system where that would really work out.

Also, if you're going to do something like that, I think you're going to have to get rid of the distinction between clubs and associations altogether. They would NEED to become the same thing. Because almost the same thing but with little changes (like with a board running it?) is going to get confusing for people.

" And maybe assocations could have a "board" of people running them. Like a president, vice president, etc."

A vice chosen by the president, sure. Multiple people who could all change things on the page, have access to the money? That sounds like a plan for disaster. Especially if (and I don't know if this was what you intended or not haha) they're voted in, not chosen by the current president.

It could probably work, but I think we need more of an idea then your rough sketch. :P /devil's advocate

I don't like this idea assuming that one person will be allowed to have multiple presidencies of clubs at one time.

Like right now, there's one person with multiple associations and they just seem to do registry and shows, but not much else. I don't see how that's fair when there are people who want associations and have tons of great ideas but either can't do them because it's already up (and sitting rather inactive) or because associations aren't being accepted at the moment. 

I DO like the idea of permanent presidents/being able to impeach them if they're not doing their jobs; but I have the same concerns as adranth. Will we have to wait for a president or will it be similar to the set up now where you can throw up a ballot during the other player's term? Also, will we still be able to buy votes? I don't particularly care for that just because someone with more money to blow is always going to win over someone who really wants to put effort into a club/association. 

Hi :)

I love the idea of associations being able to do more. I think it would also encourage people to get more involved and a different show system could add a new level of complexity and interest, like Sam said, to training. Maybe registrated horses could be given out "ribbons" or something if they were placed in the top x in association shows and these would be displayed on the horses' page. Every month, the player with the horse with the most amount of ribbons could win some player points, or an achievement award, or a bit of money, or whatever. The shows would have to have entry requirements (maybe 0-500k points, and 500k pôints) of some sort to avoid useless flooding (or maybe just being registered horses would be enough). Maybe Associations could have monthly prizes that give out tickets or 10k horse points or something?

I also like the idea of the President of the Association being able to choose a Vice president to help run, but I don't think the voting system is good in this particular example.

I like those ideas, Ardenn :).

I think for a vice president, it could be elected by the president rather than voted in, and would go out with the president if the associaiton was pruned (like how the real life US president system works).

Olli, I think if we did this, we would probably only allow people to do one club at a time. As far as votes, I don't know what we would do with buying votes. It's defintiely a "perk" for upgrades to be able to sell votes. And I think for impeaching a president, they would just stay as the president until a new one is elected - maybe an admin could tick a box that puts the club up for election and then the voting would last for 2 weeks or something. Theoretically, if people were more involved in the clubs then voting might end up being more about who is good for the job, and less about who pays the most for votes.

Addy, I think in my mind, they would still BE differnet. Joining a club would be more like joining 4H in real life, and joining an association would be more like joining the AQHA in real like. 4h has fun shows and events for the people in the club, and does a lot of community-based stuff, whereas the AQHA is all about breeding requirements, and championship shows, and big time horse farms, and that sort of thing.

I really like this, and how you compared the clubs and associations to 4H and AQHA. The more "sophisticated" show system with the associations sound great too. And I like the thought of VP's and how presidents can choose them. 

I agree with Adranth and Ollivander. I just don't know how I feel about sharing my association when I don't know the other person. Famous Shamus and I run one together but we've been partners for awhile. We do need some way to make money for the associations besides the raffles and donations from other players. BTW all the players that have donated to an association, thank you! We appreciate you!

Citali, but you would know the other person, since you would pick them!

As for the impeach process, what if the runner up in the previous election immediately took over?

I can only edit my association from my main, which is the account I had it made on. Would the "vice president" be able to edit from their own account or would they have to have access to mine? Also, do we have to choose someone else to run it with? Or could we just stay solo?

As for the club idea, what if the president didn't break any rules and wanted to stay the president forever? Then no one would ever have a chance to be able to run a club.

I'm feeling the same as Starcrossed. I don't like the idea of a President being permanent: it just doesn't seem fair. Especially if HP begins to grow.

I can definitely see a lot of good to this. But I can also see problems with one person owning a lot of the new clubs. I would like a limit if we did it that way on how many clubs one could own, and a lot more clubs.

I also share Adranths concern on how new people are voted in if someone is impeached/resigns. I would like to see it done as that a notice will be up on the club that the person will be impeached/is reaigning in x number of days (30 days at the start maybe?), and that the ballot is open. Then people can add their names and vote at that time. Moderators/Administrators would have to keep an eye on the ballots at that time for people who are inactive or accounts that are banned for whatever reason being on the ballot, so they cannot take over the term. Maybe a way for players to report the ballots as inactive people?

I think that activity should go for the whole month as well, I know its a lot, but with people consistently checking in to clubs they're interested in, they'll be able to tell if the president is active or not. I know Ive seen a few clubs just have activity through the prune period and then go dead afterwards, I've been known to do it once. (hangs head), but this way people are involved and those who are really interested get the club.
Maybe there could be a report button or message or something? If they get so many reports, they get impeached, and maybe whoever is running or interseted in being club president could put a vote in? I know people have expressed concern about leaving the club inactive for a month or however long, and I agree. I like the idea of a notification, maybe like a club message or something, that they've been impeached and there's a 24 hour process, where they actually have to get people to vote (may run into the money v votes thing but there's issues with the way everythings run, nothings perfect)

I do like the board idea, it would mean there's more than one person accountable for it being active.
I dont like the permanent idea, I'd say it could be for a certain term, maybe 6 months or something? Long enough that they get their fill, but not long enough that no one else is going to get the chance to run.

I like the idea of associations and clubs being different and there being different perks for each one. I have no other real input on the issue. This is just my two sense so far...